apriiori
random

cyan and magenta should be basic color terms

Or we could call them aqua and pink

English is said in Basic Color Terms to have eleven basic color terms:

  1. black

  2. white

  3. red

  4. green

  5. yellow

  6. blue

  7. brown

  8. orange

  9. pink

  10. purple

  11. gray

I think most English speakers would find this to be a basically accurate list. These indeed seem like the basic color terms to me.

But personally, this list has always seemed weirdly arbitrary! Like, why does light red get a basic color term? Why dark orange? Red orange yellow green blue purple white black gray would at least sort of make sense: you commit to red yellow and blue as your primary colors, for some reason, then add in the secondaries, and also add in white, black, and gray. That would feel basically sensible. But for some reason there’s pink and brown!

But even if that would sort of make sense, nowadays we have modern color theory. Whether you’re doing additive, with primary RGB and secondary CMY, or subtractive, with primary CMY and secondary RGB, that's still the same set of primary and secondary colors. So that seems like it would be a great set to have as basic color terms!

But cyan and magenta are, for some reason, not really widely considered basic color terms! Cyan and magenta are really niche compared to orange and purple, for some reason.

So the way I think of color in my hess has ended up using a list sort of like this:

  1. black

  2. white

  3. red

  4. green

  5. yellow

  6. blue

  7. brown

  8. orange

  9. pink, like for example hot pink, which is to say magenta

  10. purple

  11. gray

  12. cyan

And I think this list is pretty solid. I’m mostly happy with it. I do sometimes feel for the forgotten tertiary colors beyond orange and purple — I don’t think those all even have consistent names11 The color I habitually refer to as cyan is called aqua ny HTML and Deltarune. I don't think this particularly counts as much ambiguity, it’s not like there's any other color cyan could plausibly refer to. I guess Minecraft’s cyan is maybe sorta dark?

HTML also calls magenta fuchsia. (Why is fuchsia spelt like that. If it were fuschia I'd get it.)
. Azure22 Incredibly critical word in IPA Scrabble if you're not skilled enough to find a better usage of ʒ. is probably the one with the most consistent name. There’s also rose, seafoam green, and tennis ball.

But I think one can defend the primacy of orange and purple on the grounds of hue measured in degrees not actually perfectly corresponding to any sort of perceptually uniform color space. There's probably some Sapir–Whorfing afoot, but I do actually think it's probably a little tricker to split up lime green / seafoam green / cyan at a glance than to split up red / orange / yellow. Or at least, this doesn't seem like a totally ludicrous thing to propose to me.

One still is left thinking that brown is slightly unprincipled. I think what I’d say here is basically like, while brown is often phrased as being a sort of dark brown, it’s really broad enough to include dark and desaturated warm colors even if they’re on the redder or yellower end. So like, that’s sort of not a ridiculous thing to have even if you don’t want to have like, a dark and light version of very color as part of your main color set. But you might consider things like a tan or a beige about as justified as brown. And you might want to not leave out the cool end of the spectrum entirely — maybe you want to promote like, navy, or something.

But all those ideas are more speculative to me. Mostly I would like us to please promote cyan and magenta.

  1. The color I habitually refer to as cyan is called aqua ny HTML and Deltarune. I don't think this particularly counts as much ambiguity, it’s not like there's any other color cyan could plausibly refer to. I guess Minecraft’s cyan is maybe sorta dark?

    HTML also calls magenta fuchsia. (Why is fuchsia spelt like that. If it were fuschia I'd get it.)

  2. Incredibly critical word in IPA Scrabble if you're not skilled enough to find a better usage of ʒ.

7 comments mirrored from Substack

  1. ampdot · 1 like

    Cyan and magenta are hues.

    > Like, why does light red get a basic color term? Why dark orange? Red orange yellow green blue purple white black gray would at least sort of make sense: you commit to red yellow and blue as your primary colors, for some reason, then add in the secondaries, and also add in white, black, and gray. That would feel basically sensible. But for some reason there’s pink and brown!

    Languages develop color terms through cultural evolution. There are many scientific ways to describe colors- additive, subtractive, HSL, L*a*b, YPbPr, XYZ, Munsell- and many more ways to enshrine specific colors- Pantone for example, is the color language of corporate America. Once you recognize Pantone, you'll notice almost everything is made of it.

    Of course, two descriptivist linguists studying English would discover the colors most culturally relevant to the Anglosphere. But most organizations have their own design pallettes that describe their own set of enshrined colors.

    For example, the plural system I'm a member of uses {Brown, Yellow, Green, and Violet} as the hue axis and {Pastel, Neon} as the brightness/saturation axis. Those are the colors we care about.

    If you wanted to make it universal/impartial one could imagine expanding the number of hues and expanding the concept of brightness/saturation (names courtesy of Fable 5.1 Medium):

    Beige vs orange

    Butter vs highlighter

    Mint vs neon green

    Lavender vs electric violet

    Pastel pink vs magenta

    Baby blue vs cyan

    But this isn't of use to me, because I don't like using blue, pink, or orange. Likewise, most speakers of Greek lacked a need to describe the color of the sky, given it was uncommon in their time, and thus lacked a need for a short word for "blue" separate from green.

    Anyway, there are many systems for naming a simple set of colors. Basic Color Terms and ROYGBIV are most culturally rooted, while RYB / Berlin & Kay / opponent-process / Munsell might be more scientific.

    And in practice people use curated swatches like pantone: https://www.pantone-colours.com/

    1. ...brown is a hue???

      1. surely some browns are of yellow or green hue

  2. 💎 Tetraspace

    the basic colours are walo, pimeja, laso, jelo, loje

    the enlightened russians speak of голубой as a basic colour, a light and cold shade of laso, perhaps corresponding to your cyan

  3. ilzolende · 1 like

    It would be nice if we could have #0000FF be 'indigo' and let more cyanish shades be 'blue'. It certainly would make the classic ROYGBIV work out more nicely.

    1. my impression was that this was in fact what isaac was going for

      1. ilzolende

        you can start calling color spaces BMYK and RGI and confuse everyone :)

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